Solid oak floor installation gone bad

Discussion in 'Wood' started by Grant2016, Jan 7, 2016.

  1. Grant2016

    Grant2016 New Member

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    In November I paid to have a solid oak floor laid in my home. The area of flooring covered included one room with an old ceramic tile floor which had been down since the 60's and an concrete floor in an adjoining extension I had built in the early summer.

    Installation consisted of pouring levelling compound directly on the old tiles (but not on the concrete area in the extension) on day 1, on day 2/3 gluing the new boards and fitting skirting. He did not prime the floors or do any sort of floor preparation (even though pouting compound on smooth, glazed tiles). He also didn't perform any moisture testing.

    Things have since gone wrong. There are multiple problems which only affect the boards laid over the tiles, the boards on the concrete base of the extension are (currently) fine. Problems include:
    1. Serious buckling of the floor affecting an area of ~2sqm, where the boards had completely detached from the floor beneath.
    2. Various areas throughout the floor where the boards have detached from the floor beneath.
    3. Extensive ‘cupping’ of boards throughout, where moisture has caused the underside of the boards to expand.
    I contacted the owner of the business and he is trying to argue I have a damp problem. In my view this is hugely improbable. There is no evidence I have any damp problems.

    Here is a more detailed account of how the installation proceeded:

    On the morning of Monday November 23rd 2015, I was working on my laptop in the Livingroom when I overheard the owner telling ‘Dave’ to mix in “some of the **** stuff” since there wasn't enough of the 'good' levelling compound for the whole floor. Presumably he also watered it down excessively so as to have enough for the whole floor.

    On the night of November 23rd 2015, I was so concerned at how wet the levelling compound was that I photographed the floor and also took a short video. The media clearly shows standing water in some areas of the floor and also an area which had disintegrated. Of course the initial drying/curing time for levelling compound is between 2-4 hours. Something seemed to be wrong.

    The following morning (November 24th 2015), I looked at the floor again. As previously stated, large areas were cold and damp to the touch and the compound was dark grey, indicating to me it hadn’t dried. I took more photos and also photographed the two different brands of empty levelling compound bags which were left in the house. I also informed 'Dave' of my concerns but trusted his experience and opinion when he said it was ok to proceed.

    I've since looked at the installation details of the two brands of compound used:

    Setcrete – Universal Floor Levelling Compound
    • Application thickness 3mm to 6mm
    • 3 hour walk on time
    • “Setcrete Universal is not suitable for use when bonding solid wood flooring.”
    • “Floors should be primed to ensure good adhesion between levelling compound and substrate”
    Sikafloor Level-25
    • 4 hour walk on time
    • Priming
      “Priming with SikaLevel®-Pro Primer is essential to ensure good adhesion and reduce air release from the substrate.”
      “For very smooth e.g. steel trowel finished surfaces, grind surface prior to priming.”
    • “Use only on cementitious substrates."
    • “Concrete substrates must be prepared mechanically using abrasive blast cleaning or scarifying equipment to remove cement laitance and achieve an open textured surface.”
    • “Make sure the moisture content has achieved the required value for the application of the coating product.”
    • The concrete substrate must be sound and of sufficient compressive strength (min. 25 N/mm2) with a minimum pull off strength of 1.5 N/mm2.
    Both are only suitable for use on concrete substrates only (remember, a large area of the floor was tiled). Setcrete isn't suitable for wooden flooring.

    As far as I'm concerned he has made a mess of the installation and must fix it. He didn't make the basic moisture tests, chose the wrong installation approach and materials and didn't follow the usage guidelines of the levelling compounds he did use.

    Any opinions, assistance would be greatly appreciated.

    Also, if anyone know of reputable solid wood flooring installers near Rickmansworth who would be willing to make a professional assessment of the installation and recommendations on how to fix it, that would be helpful.
     
  2. RPB

    RPB Super Moderator Staff Member

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    I'm not into wood flooring but;

    1960s house., will have no DPM under the tiled area., and should of been treated accordingly.. Moisture is more than likely the problem..

    Then new area should be ok (but who knows???)
    I'm guessing a builder installed it, and not a floorer? Two totally different trades..
     
  3. Rugmunching

    Rugmunching Well-Known Member

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    Sounds like the screed has blown on the tiles so thats where you are feeling the floor move due to him not using the correct procedure when it comes to 'screeding over tiles'.

    Have you paid for the whole job?
    Is the firm refusing point blank to come out and even look at it?
     
  4. Rugmunching

    Rugmunching Well-Known Member

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    Post some pics up!
     
  5. pf flooring

    pf flooring Well-Known Member

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    Your best off getting a proper assessment from sid bourne if you are going to be looking to reclaim the cost of doing it right his reports will hold up in court, as id say whole lot has to come up and redo it properly, clearly this lot can't so not sure why you would think they could fix it? are they floor layers or chippy or builders? as in my opinion only one of them can do the job properly as id very much doubt that anyone other than the floorer would have the equipment to measure the moisture within the slab or screed a floor to a high enough standard.
     
  6. dazlight

    dazlight Super Moderator

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    A moisture rest was t taken which says it all.
    These cowboys are a disgrace.
    The fitter is at fault 100%
     
  7. Grant2016

    Grant2016 New Member

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    Thanks again. You've all pretty much confirmed my views, which is reassuring.

    Unfortunately, now that he has done the job I am legally obliged to allow him the opportunity to fix things. Second time around though it will be on my terms.

    As suggested, I'll be contacting Sid Bourne to make an independent assessment of the floor and recommendations for remedial action.
     
  8. SourceWoodFloors

    SourceWoodFloors Member

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    Many customer are chooses engineered oak flooring over the solid oak flooring because it is very versatile. Engineered oak floors are provide provide warmth and comfort to your home that’s why it is very compatible as covering for underfloor heating systems to protect wood floors from moisture and humidity. I suggest engineered oak flooring is best option in the moisture area.
    Thanks
    Source Wood Floors UK
     
  9. AngryAndy

    AngryAndy Well-Known Member

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    What has this comment got to do with the problem, underfloor heating hasn't been mention and how does underfloor heating protect wood floors from moisture & humidity? If you really believe your answer is correct then I would respectfully suggest you know Jack S&*t about wood flooring. The moisture problem needs fixing before any wood flooring can be installed. Engineered or otherwise. Sorry to be blunt but this is a poor attempt at advertising
     
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  10. brenchy

    brenchy Well-Known Member

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    Totally Agree with Andy
     
  11. Matt

    Matt Well-Known Member Staff Member

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    What a load of crap as Angry Andy has said. As for the floor in question, Sid time!
     
  12. Wes

    Wes Well-Known Member

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    Just a spammer Andy...Needs banning :mad:
     

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